You make the call?

[brentwalker]

No outs, no runners on base.

Batter hits a ground ball hard on a line between third and short. Third baseman makes an agressive attempt to cut off the ball and throw the batter-runner at at first. The ball was hit sharply enough that it was difficult to handle and was deflected somewhat so that neither the 3rd baseman or short could make an attempt to throw the runner out at first.

Question: Do you score the play as an:

Error or Hit

[brentwalker]

By the way FTM, It would be nice to have a *new* forum section called "You make the call" where members could describe a situation they encountered or rules they don't understand and get answers from other iScore users as well as FTM sugestions/interpretations.

I have several besides this one that I would like to ask but don't really consider them FAQ, Issues, Features, Product Updates.

I think this could be very useful to iScore users.

/bw

[jcbeckman]

Hit if you think it was nearly impossible to throw out the runner.

[brentwalker]

Sorry, forgot to include the rule

10.05 Base Hits
A base hit is a statistic credited to a batter when such batter reaches base safely, as set forth in this Rule 10.05.
(a) The official scorer shall credit a batter with a base hit when:
(2) the batter reaches first base safely on a fair ball hit with such force, or so slowly, that any fielder attempting to make a play with the ball has no opportunity to do so;
Rule 10.05(a)(2) Comment: The official scorer shall credit a hit if the fielder attempting to handle the ball cannot make a play, even if such fielder deflects the ball from or cuts off another fielder who could have put out a runner.

[FTMSupport]

Good suggestion to have a new forum for Scoring related questions... just created it:


Scoring Questions:

viewforum.php?f=14

[brentwalker]

Hit if you think it was nearly impossible to throw out the runner.

Before reading the rule, I would have thought something similar. Not sure where you got the "nearly impossible" part cause I read most of the rules to say "ordinary effort". This was no ordinary effort, he was lucky to get to it and would have made an exceptional play had he been able to hold on to the ball and make the play.

Also, I would have previously considered it an error on the part of the 3rd baseman's since the ball did connect with his glove. But reading through the "Credit an Error to" section I don't see that as a solution either.

In this case I would have to say hit to the batter and nice try to the 3rd baseman.

Any other perspectives?

[jcbeckman]

Depends a lot on what the scorer thinks the fielder is capable of. I know they're supposed to use "ordinary effort", but what's ordinary for one guy might be extraordinary for the next.

[plivengood]

You really need to see the play to make a judgment, but situations like what you've described are almost always a hit in my book. Third basemen are taught to go aggressively to the hole, because even if a shortstop gets to that ball it is a very long, tough throw - certainly not one you usually assume would be made with ordinary effort. If the defense has a chance, it is by the 3B aggressively cutting off the ball, in the direction of the throw, and I don't think it is right to penalize the 3B for doing so when he can't come up with it cleanly. For me, it probably depends on how far he had to range into the hole, and how hard the ball was hit, but it sounds like a hit to me.